Forum.Gomoku.pl

[joking]

Hello, 13.8.2005 19.00 (time should be changed due to top players abillity) will be hold on kurnik first Net Open Tournament,time for game is 10,rules swap,7 rounds,prize for winner is 100 euro sponsored by me.

Is important to do a list of player,for operator alowed to kick grey nicks,and keep all fair.

Register info with your name and nickname to netopen@email.cz

Its also important to join this tourney only with main or famous nicknames no grey please.
Regards Alan

[soul_reaper]

[joking]

List of registered players for Net Open Tourney

wywern
jabik
roy_
arczi_
ondik1
iec
suczkins_
lukasz146
utratos
_yossarian_
puholek
psycho
black_army
brawo_jasiu
gnoza_
soul_reaper
slayer18
dragon_katowice
peaceman
mariahhh
adifek
piotrek401
jacol91
empire_unders

[iec]

I would like to participate, but I don't think it's a good idea to play for money on internet, I see no way to prevent abusing and cheating. There is never guaranty when playing through internet, many ways to misbehave. Alan, why don't you organize real life tournament instead?
My opinion: I want to play, but I am not ready to pay entry fees for unsafe internet tournaments of this kind.

[soul_reaper]

I think this tournament is for these players that are not afraid of playing against unfair opponent. Should you concentrate enough, no program can beat you.

It's not easy to gather all the best players every month on the tournament in the real world. That's why organizing the tour on the net is a good idea, but the fees should be symbolic - i think like 1 or 2 Eur not 10. Of course such reael world tournament would be great, and should the idea of Net Tournaments become popular we could think of holding a final competition in the real world.

Regards Soul
--------
Mysle ze ten turniej jest dla graczy, ktorzy nie boja sie grac z nieuczciwym przeciwnikiem. Jesli sie odpowiednio skoncentrujesz zaden program Cie nie pokona.

Nie jest latwo zebrac wszsytkich najlepszych graczy na turniju w realu. Dlatego organizowanie turniejow na sieci jest dobrym pomyslem, ale wpisowe powinno byc symboliczne, 1 lub 2 Euro a nie 10. Oczywiscie taki turniej w realu bylby swietnym pomyslem i jesli idea turniejow sieciowych stanie sie popularna mozna pomyslec o zorganizowaniu turnieju finalowego w realu.

Pozdrawiam Soul

[iec]

Soul I think, its cliche. Of course you would have chance against a player who has no idea about the game and just mechanically uses some, even good program. But I want to see how a good player can beat an advanced player with database (renlib for example) support in 5 minutes. I think vast majority of players have problems with sharp openings, in case they would not remember the best moves, or have no idea about the scheme for that opening, even a seemingly good player can lose very fast. If someone would thoroughly analyse some sharp opening, put the many hours work into renlib, and use it while game against a strong oponent then even Ando Meritee would hardly survive... Just look at sucess of Adik with one opening, but he at least learned it and remembers it, so it's ok. Or look how Ondik suceeded with some risky openings. If he approached a player who knows the scheme, he losses in few moves, but in the other case he earned many points.

Now imagine someone would collect all variants of such risky opening into one database and play against you, your disadvantage would be really huge and I want to see your optimism then. May be some already does it, who knows, thats the uncertainity of internet.

We are just nicks, only those who meet in real life tournament are slightly proven. That's why some players never recognize joking or puholek, until they play more real life tournaments and show the power there, because everything can be just an illusion on internet.

It can be always just some fame-addicted person who cheats all the time. Thats why a better approach is to concentrate on ourselves, without thinking about the opponents, because we ourself are real, the rest might be just internet illusion.

Thats the thing I want to get from those games like chess, gomoku and similar, something what enhances myself, my logic of thinking, pattern recognition, variants calculation etc. Pity I fail so far, but it's good to believe in future that this brings something to us.

So my real aim is not to be good at some of these silly games, but to reach the stage where I actually gain something from them for the power of my stupid mind.

Sorry for this longer post, but I somehow got inspiration while thinking about this problem.

[soul_reaper]

Actually, in a 5 minute game this may pose a real threat, but renlib support sucks when the opponent does not know your opening. So there is a great opportunity for top players to invent some new openings. In longer games though eg. on brainking or littlegolem it really doesn't matter whether one plays with 'program support' or not. It may be even funny if you can quickly enough recognize software your opponent is using, and use its weakness to your advantage.

[joking]

well ,Im not care about such a stupid 100 euro,or if someone use a database or engine,or a programs ,why? its a gomoku with many variants of openings thats why all programs are weak and full of bugs,in renju are not so many openings and also not many are usable,so the programs are stronger,same in chess about 90 opens all usable thats why chess programs are very powerfully, depend number of games saved in databases and also fast processors.
Anyway you are right ,we cannt keep it if someone has a help,so we can discuss to open this tourney for everyone,and every programs and databases and create 10 mins time game swap ,and then make a final tourney for first ten players in 1 min swap,we well se how funny will be this help , do someone agree??Lets talk about it.

[iec]

May be we could create some kind of Grand Prix. For example 8 open tournaments 5 or 10 min swap, with clear rules what is needed to advance (for example some points regarding to placement), and then the group of best players can meet in 2 min swap final or something . Players who visibly abuse will be disqualified and not be able to enter after first occurence of bad behaviour.

Or may be the opposite, qualification 1 and 2 min swap tournaments and final 10 min swap. Abusers will not survive those 1-2 mins so wont get into final

[zukole]

Może ktoś przenieść to na polski ?

[joking]

Im fine with one tourney every month with clear rules ,and final touney for top ten players ,I want create this tourney to be sure that top world players are join it and it will be funny to see them all in one day ,in official tourney are participate max 5 strong players ,some new grey nicks etc,thats why i want to create this.Is it easy to understand now?

[soul_reaper]

specjalnie dla dressa Tlumaczenia moga zawierac skroty spowodowane lenistwem tlumaczacego

[roy_]

i think net open tourney for money in net is great idea:)

tour in real world here in polisch are very rarely and if you win you win money for train back to home so if your skill is on 2200 there is no motivation to be better and better but now if once in moth will be tour for money this is great motivation

and now i have big motivation to be better and improve my skill and it doesnt matter for me if somene play with program but it wuold be better if time for player will be 10 min then we have more chance to beat even the best program( but as jjoking said programs in gomoku are weak)

i think if i win on 10 min and i will be 10 on 1 min this is nothing special . so make tour on 1 min is not importent

and maybe good player wont retired after make a eg 2300 coz gomoku wont be develop if good players will be retired!! now if we have tourneys for money good players will fight for 2400 and 2500

and importent is that there is last time realy boring on kurnik only if there is tiger_shark there is emotion and there is fight

tourney for money is future



do polskich graczy- i co uwazaliscie ze to jest niemozilwe a jak juz to w odleglej przyszlosci zoorganizownaie turnieji na pienadze- i teraz bad_mojo lub jopq wygrajcie tymi swoimi programami - ktore byly najwieksza przeszkoda w org takiego turnieju-

ps . ece szkoda ze nie juz ma tematu turniejke na pienaidze

pozdro 600

[angst]

Fajna idea, ale jestem przeciwny grze w Internecie na pieniadze. Co innego w realu, gdzie widzimy jak przeciwnik sie poci i mysli nad ruchem itd.

Wprowadzenie do i tak zdeprawowanego swiatka gomoku pieniedzy doprowadzi do pogorszenia sytuacji, a byc moze nawet do sprowadzenia na zla droge uczciwych do tej pory graczy.

Ciesze sie, ze gralem na kilku turniejach w realu, bo dzieki temu mam pewnosc, ze przynajmniej niektorzy gracze spotykani codziennie w Kurniku graja samodzielnie. Nikogo nie oskarzam, ale jak gra Joking, Puholek czy Marcin133 (nicki zupelnie przypadkowe sposrod tych, ktorych nie znam w rzeczywistosci) tak naprawde nie mam pojecia. A przyklad gracza Johnl z EL dowodzi najdobitniej, ze pokusa oszukiwania jest duza, a pieniadze moga ja zwielokrotnic.

Abstrahujac od samej komercjalizacji gry w Internecie, jestem ciekaw, na jakich zasadachodbywac sie ma taki turniej? Stworzenie turnieju prywatnego? Grupy? System pucharowy? Kazdy z kazdym? Przydalaby sie taka informacja. I jak beda wygladac przyszle wplaty? Wysylamy pieniadze do Czech, zeby pograc z najlepszymi?

Z checia zagram w turnieju z gwiazdami, ale na pewno nie bede za to placil. Popieram tu calkowicie Soula i Ieca. Jestem jednak jak najbardziej za, jezeli chodzi o zwiekszenie puli nagrod w turniejach w realu, co jednak nie jest rzecza latwa.

Ostatnie pytanie - co na to Maf? W koncu bedziecie grac u niego A on za gre oplat nie pobiera

Pozdrawiam

Angst

P.S. Roy, nie mow hop dopoki nie przeskoczysz. jak na razie zaden taki turniej sie nie odbyl. Jesli Alan wylozy 100 Euro to pewnie iles osob zagra. Ciekaw jednak jestem, ile osob wystartuje, gdy bedzie koniecznosc wysuplania 10 Euro za gre.

Short summary in english:

Playing for money in real - ok, playing for money via Internet - absolutely no.
What will be the rules of the tournament?
What Maf would say about such idea?

[joking]

Ok in case that this tournament could be created and managed only through private tourney and maximum of round are closed for 9 ,Im for 10 swap,about future started fee we can cancelled this ,i will sponsored every month one of this tourney ,only in case that some federation take a management of sending money to the account ,is it possible we will see.
About win prize as Im joking this is not a joke ,and of course in case of my win the prize got the second one.I hope that this tourney is funny,and will be good fight,even some cheaters or abusers join it,top red players must beat even such this.....And rest? There many official tourneys. So dont cry that someone beat you fairy or not,lets study opening and be better.Every top sportsmens use help and study theory and technique.